Well, tomorrow is the Vice-Presidential debate. Those non-Hoosiers who tune in–almost certainly not the “YUGE” number that viewed the Presidential face-off–will get a chance to see what Indiana citizens have been living with for three-and-a-half years. If the Mike Pence who shows up is the Mike Pence who has embarrassed us in prior media confrontations (George Stephanopolis wasn’t the only one), it will give Hoosier Republicans yet another reason to abandon the Trump/Pence ticket.
It’s worth noting that Pence’s wooden and inadequate public performances are the least of those reasons.
Recently, Pence was asked which Vice-President he would model himself after in the event the Trump-Pence ticket prevailed. His tone-deaf but undoubtedly sincere response was “Dick Cheney.”
As a recent post to DailyKos pointed out,
If Donald Trump wins the election, we know two things with certainty: 1) he’ll implement the most racist, xenophobic, militant immigration policy this nation has possibly ever seen; 2) he won’t have the attention span to preside over any other issues of governance.
That’s where Mike Pence comes in and if you haven’t been paying attention to what he’s been saying, you’re not getting the full picture of how wildly non-empathic, socially conservative, science-less, anti-woman, anti-LGBTQ and downright scary a “Trump” administration would be.
Now, DailyKos has a lefty perspective, but it is very hard to argue with any of the quoted language.
Those of us who have watched Pence “govern” during what would pretty clearly have been his single term in the Statehouse have noted his oh-so-“Christian” passions: his determination to de-fund Planned Parenthood (despite the fact that such action would leave thousands of poor women with no healthcare); his seething hostility to the gay community (that one would have been hard to miss); his campaign to fund religious schools with tax dollars taken from the public schools.
His antagonism to science, denial of climate change (and evolution, for that matter), and efforts to have Indiana avoid compliance with environmental rules, have been fairly high-profile.
And since he joined the Trump Train, we’ve learned how sensitive he is to racial issues. (Irony alert.) Asked in an interview about the string of police shootings of unarmed black men, Pence responded
“Trump and I believe there’s been far too much talk about institutional bias and racism within law enforcement”
Translation: Because if we don’t talk about it, people like us who encourage it won’t have to answer these uncomfortable questions.
During the 3 plus years he’s been in office, Hoosiers of both parties have come to recognize the Governor as an ideologue uninterested in the nitty-gritty of public administration, a man whose purpose in running for public office has been essentially theocratic–to use whatever power he can muster to impose his personal religious views on citizens who don’t share them.
During the Presidential campaign, it has become clear that Trump has even less interest than Pence in actually doing the day-to-day work of governing, if he even recognizes what that work entails. When Donald Junior approached John Kasich about the Vice-Presidency, several media outlets reported that the offer came with a promise that, if Kasich accepted, he would be given broad authority over the Executive Branch–essentially, he could run the show while The Donald preened for cameras and indulged his self-importance.
Kasich–being both honorable and in possession of his senses–said no thanks.
Pence–being neither–evidently accepted the bargain.
Enjoy the debate.
And yet… Trump and Pence may well win this state. How sad.
I’ll admit right now, there is no way I’m getting up at 3am to watch this debate. I’ll be looking for a rerun view of it and usually CNN Int’l provides that.
I hope that Tim Kaine has done his homework about Pence so that the rest of the world can see this fraud for who he is. In fact, Pence being V.P. scares me just as much as a Trump Presidency does.
Who would have thought that after what everyone considered Trump’s worst week; wasn’t his worst after all! He just keeps coming back to top the WORST week he’s ever had to make it even more so. Seriously! Trump has lost his freaking mind. How sad indeed, patmcc that the GOP is set to win Indiana. ugh.
Patmcc- currently 538 give Trump-Pence over 96% chance of winning Indiana. Sad!
I meant gives.
Clinton/Kane ticket is a long shot in Indiana; part of that proud Hoosier tradition of blinding oneself to the facts and supporting the GOP.
I plan to watch the debate to, hopefully, learn WHO Tim Kaine is and what he stands for. I am already too aware of Pence and know WHAT he is. There must be a valid reason Tim Kaine was selected to join Hillary; the reasoning for choosing Pence is obvious to me. He is as racist and bigoted as Trump and easily led; he hasn’t had an original thought since becoming Mitch Daniels’ clone in our Governor’s Office.
Sheila; I hope your all-caps use of the word “YUGE” is tongue in cheek – that word irritates me to my core. I suppose it will appear in future dictionaries and be considered an actual word. Whoever started the usage, like whoever taught George W the term “benchmark”, should be shot, then hung. Petty; oh yes but, this election has reduced me to knit-picking and pettiness and looking for comments from Sarah Palin and Michelle Bachman to relieve the tension. I hate the thoughts of spending evenings alone watching these ridiculous debates and election night.
Interesting that Hoosiers would have likely rejected Pence as an incumbent for Governor yet support his bid for an office where his loathsome ideology carries so much more risk to them and the nation.
I think you’ll all like Tim Kaine. I’m kind of relishing the thought of the Jesuit trained Kaine going against the theology spouting Pence.
Let’s not leave off Mike Pence’s clichéd, cowardly, and deadly positions on gun violence—self defined by his proudly touted “A” rating with ‘the other Lord and Master’, the NRA.
In short, Pence is one of the NRA and corporate gun-lobby’s most obedient boy scouts—he dutifully rejects the most basic of life-saving measures, including universal background checks—and he eagerly supports the dismantling of the few laws currently on the books, which, at a minimum, reduce the shameful slaughter of American children, teens, teachers, law enforcement, fathers, sons, mothers, daughters, sisters, and brothers…
Indianapolis is on track to top it’s 2015 all time homicide record AND was recently ranked the 13th most dangerous city in the United States.
Equally deserving of illumination is the fact that Indiana’s suicide rate is rising 50% faster than the American average–and, notwithstanding the rejection and denial by gun rights mouthpieces–the research shows that states with higher gun ownership have higher rates of suicide and that access to a gun increases the likelihood that an at-risk person will act on a suicidal impulse–whereas, without access, the likelihood of the individual overcoming the impulse is higher.
Despite mountains of evidence to the contrary—
Mike Pence believes with conviction, thus enthusiastically propagates the misguided ideology that the 2nd Amendment and basic, common-sense gun legislation cannot coexist—and Americans pay, in lives, for such ignorance.
If course it’s possible that Don the con taught or requires Pence to follow the “party” line and just lie. For some reason their popularity seems unaffected by their truly dismal political fact check record. Some voters seem to think that trustworthiness is like climate change. Other than being an existential threat, not very important.
Comparing Kaine and Pence is like comparing French chocolate and horse doots. I expect a Pence disaster.
I consider this election to be a once in a lifetime opportunity: While pulling the lever against one, I’ll hit two. It’s a “two-fer”.
Mark,
“Interesting that Hoosiers would have likely rejected Pence as an incumbent for Governor yet support his bid for an office where his loathsome ideology carries so much more risk to them and the nation.”
It’s because that “loathsome ideology” WHITE SUPREMACY overrides all common sense. Just check out Nazi Germany and see where racism will ultimately take you…..CATASTROPHE. We’re following their steps, step by step. They created a WORLD WAR. We’re creating a RACE WAR. The final results will be pretty much the same.
God save the United States of America! Is there anyone else who can do it at this place and time? I doubt it.
Marv, they are not creating a race war. They are a dying generation of calcified brains trying to prevent the world from changing. They will fail.
Oh, Indiana, I have such contempt for you, along with the rest of defiantly stupid middle America. Couldn’t you just be smart for once?
Over it,
I applaud your optimism.
We are witnessing the universe correcting it’s only historian, mankind. Like children we don’t take correction kindly. So reality has to hold firm.
Believe me it will. We will lose to it, inevitably.
Pete,
What is the “reality that has to hold firm”? Are you talking about democracy, goodwill, etc.?
I have not yet decided if I will watch the debate. I do know that I cannot stomach listening to Pence and would have to constantly mute the tv when he talks. Actually, I don’t believe that I can tolerate even looking at him. That is how disgust and disdain I have for him.
Like Kasich, Pence was promised that he would basically be running the country if Trump wins. I am tired of being punished by the voting record of Republicans who refuse to fact check or do any research on their candidates, yet complain the loudest when nothing changes.
Sometimes ANGER is a good thing. It motivates. It can prevent paralysis.
pa-ral-y-sis (pe ral’e sis) n., pl. -ses’ (-sez) [<Gr. paralyein, to loosen or weaken at the side] l. partial or complete loss of voluntary motion or of sensation in part or all of the body 2. Any condition of helpless inactivity–par-a-lyt-ic (par'e lit'ik) adj.,n.
~Webster's New World Dictionary
Marv, you’re right about that world war…just check out the rhetoric here in Europe lately. Immigrant hate, immigrant ‘go home’, immigrants “either learn the customs and language in our country or get out!” Trump has given the bigots a voice over here too. The marches in France, in Germany, the referendum in Hungry…Trump is doing this worldwide and we need to stop him and shut him up before it becomes a virus – worldwide.
Marv, my biggest worry is the demonization of knowledge and to me the biggest threat from it is anthropogenic global warming. Certainly not the only threat to the future but the closest to existential.
Until we return to the power of knowledge for creating progress we are hopelessly lost and danger lurks everywhere.
Thank you for reminding us of the Trump campaign’s incredible offer to Kasich to be V.P. AND in charge of all domestic and international policy. When Kasich’s staff asked Don Trump Jr. what then the President would be in charge of, the answer was “making America great again”.
When I told that to a friend, she burst out laughing.
AgingLGrl,
“Trump is doing this worldwide and we need to stop him and shut him up before it becomes a virus – worldwide.”
It is already a virus – worldwide. A few years ago, I was in an E-mail exchange with Ulla Gudmundson, former head of intelligence for Sweden in the EU and later Ambassador to the Vatican. At that time, I warned her of the virulent hatred that was mounting in the U.S. and was being exported into Europe via the internet. No convincing was necessary. The virus is no secret in European intelligence circles.
Trump/Pence is the #1 danger to the world right now. And we think he is going to be stopped through a debate.
As I have often opined, Hillary will win big this fall with or without the Hoosier electoral count. As I (a Florida voter) see it, therefore, I think the bigger concern of Hoosiers should be to destroy the super majority in their legislature, a clear and present danger to democracy because whoever is elected governor is a figurehead what with such a majority. The legislature becomes the owner of executive power as well as legislative since the governor’s veto can be easily over-ridden. So long as that super-majority holds, the governor is effectively beholden to the legislature and Hoosiers will have no tripartite system of government as envisioned by Madison and copied by state constitutions. Hoosiers may have a bigger problem in being represented as citizens than a choice between Trump and Hillary, gerrymandering, voter suppression etc. The basic system isn’t working with such lopsided concentration of power.
For a rational take on the dangers of Donald Trump by one of America’s foremost experts on intelligence, take a look at the post by Larry Hancock author of “Surprise Attack” on his blog today.
https://larryhancock.wordpress.com/2016/10/03/presidents-as-commander-in-chief/#comment-2145
Gerald: Amen!
Gerald: All I can add is, “Amen!”
Gerald,
All very true – and I fear we will continue with the same.